Denied Fixing engineering progression and roleplay opportunities without dev work

[Zen]

What does this suggestion change/add/remove:

Edit the IT Technician job in the following ways:

• Make CL2 instead of CL1
• Change level requirements from Total Level 5 to Total Level 20, Support Level 10, in line with Doctor
• Add door overrides for CL3 offices and similar rooms (for access to terminals in low-risk areas)
• Add player limit of 5 (currently unlimited)
• EDIT: Add Clipboard

Edit the Technical Expert job in the following ways:

• Make CL3 instead of CL2
• Change level requirements from Total Level 20, Support Level 10 to Total Level 40, Support Level 20, in line with Senior Doctor
• Keep door overrides for LCZ and HCZ electrical (all of the others are for CL3 areas, so no need to keep those)
  • (Optional) Add door overrides to SCP-079 and SCP-682 containment chambers.
• (Optional) Rename the job to "Senior Engineer" (in my opinion Tech Expert is not a great name)
• EDIT: Add panic button
• EDIT: Add helmet camera

Edit the Engineer job in the following ways:

• Give door overrides to CL2 SCPs' outer doors within LCZ and keep the ones it already has
• EDIT: Add Clipboard

Has something similar been suggested before? If so, why is your suggestion different?:
There have been many previous suggestions regarding the creation of a maintenance/engineering/E&TS department, most of which have either been rejected or have been accepted and then later dropped. This differs from most of them in that it does not create any jobs, only edits two existing ones. This means that it should be able to be done by a Senior Admin+ using VJobEditor in about 15 minutes (depending on if VJobEditor bugs out, which it does sometimes). It also does not suggest making any combative roles or any other large scale changes, and should not require any dev work.

This is a smaller subset of my recent, similar suggestion here. That suggestion was rejected for "job bloat" (it added a single job) and for "being a large rework requiring a decent amount of dev time" (it was somewhat more extensive, and some parts required a minor amount of dev time, such as adding a job approval to Tech Expert, adding a new prop placer SWEP, and [possibly] adding a new job [this reportedly may require dev work as VJobEditor apparently is bad at creating jobs]). I have removed any elements that the denial reason covered - it should only require a VJobEditor change two two existing jobs, and adds no new jobs.

This also doesn't request a CL4 E&TS role, which was recently specifically denied for unspecified reasons beyond "We believe that this is not needed".

Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2):

• Significantly improves progression for engineering roles
  • Currently, there are only two levels of progression: Engineer/IT Technician, and Tech Expert. That's a single move. Once you get to Tech Expert, there's nowhere else to go, and it's currently only a Support 10 job. This would mean there would be three tiers of engineering jobs, up to Total 40/Support 20.
  • With the current jobs being limited to a maximum of CL2, this very much feels like a dead end. Many interactions are locked behind CL3 for RP, and the only way directly up is to Site Administration, which is a senior CL4 position - a big leap from CL2.
  • Opportunities for progression are often an incentive for people to actively play roles that they enjoy
• Significantly improves roleplay opportunities with/as engineering roles
  • IT Technician is very limited by its CL1 nature and extremely limited access - they can't access most offices except the GSD and RSD CL1 ones, and can barely do anything related to their actual job as a result. An IT Technician needs to be able to access computers and servers or they can't do anything.
  • Many roleplay opportunities are locked behind CL3+ clearance. This is due to a combination of reasons such as an inability to know/access CL3 information and areas that are key to the site, a general expectation that CL2 and below roles are new players and thus unable to carry out notable RP, and also a general attitude amongst many that CL2 and below are essentially beneath them because any roles worth working towards are CL3+ (MTF roles start at CL3, "Senior" roles are CL3 and are seen as a minimum by many for actual RP, DEA and ISD roles start at CL3, etc.)
  • With access to more areas, roleplay opportunities increase simply due to the greater potential for interaction with others and the greater number of areas available to roleplay in. For example, it would open up more SCPs to roleplay with or around for Tech Experts, which on its own would be a significant boon as there is a noticeable focus on the CL3+ SCPs on both servers for both combat and roleplay, none of which any of the engineering roles can currently access.
• Gives different jobs a much more sensible number of things to do as part of base gameplay (especially IT Technician)
  • IT Technician currently can only access CL1 areas, and only has a Technician Tool, which can only repair terminals (which aren't broken that often). This gives the job an extremely limited number of things to do, as there aren't that many terminals within CL1 areas, and there isn't really anything else to do in these areas for this role. By providing them with overall CL2 access, they would be able to access a wider variety of areas, and by providing them with override access to low-risk CL3 offices (e.g. medical, research, security sector), they would have access to a much larger number of terminals and RP environments.
• More roleplay opportunities for everyone else
  • While this provides significant roleplay and gameplay opportunities for the engineering roles, the expansion of roleplay availability for them also does the same for every other department, as they can do roleplay with engineering roles.
• A likely reductionin overall "minge" behaviour on these roles
  • A big problem that leads to this is simply that there's nothing to do - both roleplay and gameplay-wise. Until recently on UK, there was very little that even Tech Experts, with the maximum clearance the department has, could do outside of repairing doors after breaches. However, with the addition of various filing cabinets in the office, a small but notable increase in access to various places and things around the site, an overall increase in encouragement and opportunity to roleplay, and at least a small amount of attention from staff (fancy office layout and equipment, some events now and then), there seems to have been a noticeable increase in active roleplay and a decrease in FailRP and similar behaviour on the engineering roles. Shockingly, people are more likely to just do whatever if they aren't given an opportunity to do something actually sensible.
• EDIT: Provides a good base for the upcoming containment maintenance system, which would require engineering staff to enter containment chambers and the like (which isn't currently possible for many SCPs with maximum CL2 roles)

Possible Negatives of the suggestion:

• CL3 access could potentially be abused
  • Generally, the idea of "people might minge" shouldn't be used to ruin things for everyone else. Staff should just deal with FailRP, and ISD should deal with IC rule breaks.
  • There isn't a significant amount that someone could do to cause issues that someone with CL2 couldn't already do that wouldn't be easily prevented. They can access CL3 areas and information - there isn't really anything of significance here other than in positive ways, the worst you could do is be a mild nuisance in LHCZ. They could access armouries, but it's outright FailRP for these roles to use weapons for anything other than self-defence, so they couldn't cause any significant problems even with guns without staff easily finding and pulling them for it, and you don't exactly see this problem with roles like Senior Doctor or Senior Researcher, who can already do this. They could dispense a TE-5, but anything they could do that would actually be disruptive would probably be easily caught as FailRP (e.g. breaching an SCP), so staff can just pull them and easily warn/ban them. As it is, anyone that is actually planning to cause problems can easily do so using 1162/914, or by picking up a card off a body (which is commonly possible).
• People might actually play these roles
  • People already do
  • This literally isn't a real problem
  • But some in Content seem to think it is
  • This is a roleplay server, a few people playing this instead of e.g. an MTF role at a time isn't an actual problem and instead just contributes to roleplay.
  • It's also only three jobs, and the three jobs already exist, so this should already be a problem if the roles were sensible as-is. This just fixes the roles to be more sensible and usable.
  • People will also be playing these roles more often to do roleplay rather than mess around as some have done in the past. So roughly the same number of people, but more people actively roleplaying rather than just hanging around, messing around, or temporarily flagging on to fix one thing and leave.

Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted:
The benefits listed above are very significant, both for people that may play these roles, and for everyone else, as the expansion of roleplay opportunities benefits everyone around who might be included in such roleplay. The main concerns of potential abuse are also very overblown - there's not much someone could do with CL3 that they couldn't do with CL2 and a bit of time to cause problems, and everything they can do that's an actual problem are very easily caught failRP and other server rule breaks, which will just result in staff sits, warns and bans for anyone that does this, the same as how it already does (or should, if your staff are actually moderating properly).

This overall gives a massive boost to roleplay opportunities on/with these roles, for very little downside (that isn't easily mitigated).


Note: Right now on UK, Tech Experts have override access to the LHCZ corridors already, which is a significant bonus and may also be used as an example of how this sort of thing really isn't a problem. If Content Team are unsure about this, I'd recommend just waiting and seeing if any notable issues arise from this and using this as part of your decision making - I really don't expect any problems out of this, and it should help a decent amount towards roleplay and gameplay, though doesn't go quite as far as I'd like (that's what this suggestion is for). Alternatively, if this is denied, I'd request both an actual reason ("we don't believe it's necessary" isn't a reason - this is an SCP-RP Garry's Mod server, none of this is necessary, it's fun), and the ability to re-submit the same suggestion later on if the recent UK changes show to have worked.

EDIT: This suggestion is one of two related suggestions. You can find the other here.

 

[Zen]

Personally, i'd say they should make it so there is panic buttons around site, like one outside of 096's chamber and when you press it as foundation, it says the panic button location and then people can respond, as a substitute to techies having their own panic buttons on them at all times

That's not a terrible idea, though I personally think that tech experts should have them just because they are a role that is specifically often in danger. They could implement this as part of the announcement system call stations. I'm gonna add that to my list of planned suggestions if someone doesn't do it before me.

 

[Aithaed]

Suggestion Denied

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Hi Zen,

Thanks for taking the time to make a server suggestion.
The Content Team has chosen to deny your suggestion due to the following reasons.

There are insufficient gameplay elements for CL3 ET&S roles to fulfill, making such jobs become bloat. Sequentially, a CL2 role is capable of fulfilling all functions that a CL3 role would be capable of.

Your suggestion will now be locked and marked as denied.​