- Sep 16, 2023
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What does this suggestion change/add/remove:
This suggestion aims to massively rework the surface-level factions and inter-faction RP, along with overall reducing RP disruption. This comes in two main steps.
The second, possibly optional phase would then be as follows, if phase one is completed:
I would also suggest a further third step, if step two is implemented, but which I also suggest regardless of if both step 1 and 2 are denied:
Has something similar been suggested before? If so, why is your suggestion different?:
Almost certainly not.
Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2):
Possible Negatives of the suggestion:
Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted:
This would overall massively reduce regular RP disruption in the long-term, which has been a consistent issue no matter what CT/SL/NL has tried over the years. I don't think there's any way to actually fix this without just outright removing CI as a permanent faction, and I think the replacement I've suggested would be a good alternative to add some spice and to keep some fun aspects of CI (raiding and countering) and the VIP benefits related to the faction (TB and DC would still exist and be limited to VIP, they'd just be deployed in a different format), while losing some key problems (raids spiralling due to them lasting too long and not having goals [or self-preservation], frequency of disruption, raids essentially just being MRDM but allowed, etc.). I don't think CI really fits as a permanent faction, but I think a system like what I've described could keep them as a fun aspect of the server (and a continued draw to new players) while massively improving the state of RP overall. Their current state just doesn't fit an RP server, and doesn't seem like it ever will, and I genuinely do not think this change would really detract from the overall server experience in any meaningful way outside of the short-term upheaval that such a large change would cause regardless of the end result.
This suggestion aims to massively rework the surface-level factions and inter-faction RP, along with overall reducing RP disruption. This comes in two main steps.
The first step is the removal of CI as a permanent faction on the server. This means that there would no longer be a fourth faction to create a character on - only Civilian, Foundation, and GOC would remain in this way. They would still exist in a new form, but would not be a permanent faction with a roster and set positions.
In the long-run, this would potentially mean that the CI base could be removed from the map. I'd personally prefer to see that in the form of:
Once CI is removed as a playable faction, it would be replaced by three aspects:
GM Events
Any major RP involving CI as a faction would be played by GMs/event staff/supporting players.
Raids
Every 3-4 hours (with the time being partially random, to prevent guessing when it will happen), players with a high enough Combat and Total XP level on any faction will get a prompt, similar to ERT calls, to join a CI raid. This prompt will only show to those that are called, with no warning to anyone else. Anyone that accepts it will be respawned as CI in an ERT-like deployment system, where CI will arrive in Pinewood either via helicopters near compound/vents, or via a vehicle convoy from outside of the map (via the part of the road that exits the playable space of the map) - or both at the same time.
When raids are arriving, there should be a chance that a site announcement would play, alerting the Foundation to something along the lines of "Radar has picked up an unknown aircraft entering into your nearby airspace. Please be on alert.", or "Nearby Foundation assets have alerted us to an oncoming convoy of vehicles of an unknown origin. Please be on alert.". This could either be by random chance as to whether it's caught or not, or via an actual radar system that can break down and need repairs (or be sabotaged) located within compound.
During the CI deployment animation phase, CI should be given a clear, set objective, with the possible objectives being different depending on the server population and the raid size (e.g. no 008 breach objectives at 40 pop). Objectives would be ones like so:
Undercover Missions
Every 2-3 hours (with the time being partially random), a Deep Cover mission equivalent would start, with a ERT-style call up. Those that accept would only be told their disguise and mission upon spawning as CI, not during the call up phase itself (to minimise potential metagaming). These deep cover agents would then spawn as a set Foundation job (selected by the server, based on which mission was randomly selected), such as Senior Researcher, or Janitor, and be prompted to select a name for this character. The DCs would spawn in that job's spawn, looking like that job, and with the correct job title and keycard for the job. For all intents and purposes, they would be that job, except they'd have a CMission-style objective to complete, similar to the above described Raid system. They would also be told who their fellow Deep Cover(s) are by name, job and appearance, even if they didn't spawn together (e.g. a mission might spawn one DC as a Tech Expert, and another as a GSD Guard). They would not appear on the tab-list as Deep Cover, but instead maybe as the actual role itself.
Selected Deep Covers would be given an objective such as the following:
It should be possible for a GM to specify a mission in this way, too.
In the long-run, this would potentially mean that the CI base could be removed from the map. I'd personally prefer to see that in the form of:
- A GM-supported/led event occurs prior to restart - a siege on and then bombing of CI base, resulting in all inside being killed and the base being mostly destroyed.
- During this, SOP should aim to steal every document they can to look through at a later date.
- Server restarts at the end of the event, with the restart bringing with it both the updated map and the removed/changed CI faction.
- New map essentially just has most of the CI base removed (everything beyond the garage, basically).
- Garage outer doors are broken, jammed, unpowered, and partially open.
- Within the garage is a dark and damaged room, with small bits of rubble and visible damage to everything within, lights hanging from the ceiling, and no power or lighting active.
- Signs outside warn the public that it is unsafe and condemned.
- The entrance from the garage to the rest of the base is just blocked off by rubble, and the rest of the base no longer exists.
- You can enter via the broken door, to give some atmosphere and maybe a usable place for some RP and civilian exploration stuff, but you can't pass the rubble in the inner doorway.
- Maybe play some SFX and particle effects in the garage indicating the rubble shifting and the place being unsafe every now and then.
Once CI is removed as a playable faction, it would be replaced by three aspects:
GM Events
Any major RP involving CI as a faction would be played by GMs/event staff/supporting players.
Raids
Every 3-4 hours (with the time being partially random, to prevent guessing when it will happen), players with a high enough Combat and Total XP level on any faction will get a prompt, similar to ERT calls, to join a CI raid. This prompt will only show to those that are called, with no warning to anyone else. Anyone that accepts it will be respawned as CI in an ERT-like deployment system, where CI will arrive in Pinewood either via helicopters near compound/vents, or via a vehicle convoy from outside of the map (via the part of the road that exits the playable space of the map) - or both at the same time.
When raids are arriving, there should be a chance that a site announcement would play, alerting the Foundation to something along the lines of "Radar has picked up an unknown aircraft entering into your nearby airspace. Please be on alert.", or "Nearby Foundation assets have alerted us to an oncoming convoy of vehicles of an unknown origin. Please be on alert.". This could either be by random chance as to whether it's caught or not, or via an actual radar system that can break down and need repairs (or be sabotaged) located within compound.
During the CI deployment animation phase, CI should be given a clear, set objective, with the possible objectives being different depending on the server population and the raid size (e.g. no 008 breach objectives at 40 pop). Objectives would be ones like so:
- Breach <specific, randomly-selected, breachable SCP> from containment
- Kidnap <1-5> key staff
- Retrieve <specific, randomly-selected SCP> from the site
- If successful, this SCP should disappear/be disabled for a set amount of time (maybe 30 minutes or so).
- Retrieve <3-8> keycards of different types
- Cause a major disruption
- E.g. any major breach, 008 breach, turning off reactor, or just killing a lot of people
Undercover Missions
Every 2-3 hours (with the time being partially random), a Deep Cover mission equivalent would start, with a ERT-style call up. Those that accept would only be told their disguise and mission upon spawning as CI, not during the call up phase itself (to minimise potential metagaming). These deep cover agents would then spawn as a set Foundation job (selected by the server, based on which mission was randomly selected), such as Senior Researcher, or Janitor, and be prompted to select a name for this character. The DCs would spawn in that job's spawn, looking like that job, and with the correct job title and keycard for the job. For all intents and purposes, they would be that job, except they'd have a CMission-style objective to complete, similar to the above described Raid system. They would also be told who their fellow Deep Cover(s) are by name, job and appearance, even if they didn't spawn together (e.g. a mission might spawn one DC as a Tech Expert, and another as a GSD Guard). They would not appear on the tab-list as Deep Cover, but instead maybe as the actual role itself.
Selected Deep Covers would be given an objective such as the following:
- Assassinate <randomly selected person>
- Penalties should apply for excess kills, to prevent them from just MRDMing and getting lucky.
- Steal the keycard of <randomly selected person> and get it to the dead drop at <random surface level location>
- Breach <randomly selected SCP> and leave the site
- Retrieve <randomly selected document of CL4 or higher> and get it to the dead drop at <random surface level location>
- Sabotage <randomly selected system>
It should be possible for a GM to specify a mission in this way, too.
The second, possibly optional phase would then be as follows, if phase one is completed:
Given Nu-7's primary purpose is to fight off CI and combat them on surface, removing CI may mean there's no longer sufficient reason to keep Nu-7 as well. If this is the case, then they should be removed as a permanent regiment, with their remaining duties (manning compound/garage/EZ, interacting with GOIs, and general combat) being fully absorbed into the other departments that already at least partially do the same thing (GSD, DEA, and the other MTFs).
I would also suggest a further third step, if step two is implemented, but which I also suggest regardless of if both step 1 and 2 are denied:
We currently have an ERT system that aims to fight SCP breaches that get out of hand. I suggest an additional, different ERT force with the purpose of combating raids and riots that get out of hand. They would be called up manually via the ERT phone, but be callable under different conditions than the SCP-focused ERT.
This Nu-7-style ERT (possibly called Nu-7, even, if step 2 goes ahead) would be equipped with weapons and gear suitable to fighting humans rather than SCPs, with potentially lower armour/health, and weapons such as the ARX, sticky grenades, flashbangs, etc. rather than things like the Auger, AA-12, shield wall, and sentry.
This style of ERT would land either via helicopters as usual, or via a vehicle convoy entering the map from the road that goes outside of the map's playable space.
This Nu-7-style ERT (possibly called Nu-7, even, if step 2 goes ahead) would be equipped with weapons and gear suitable to fighting humans rather than SCPs, with potentially lower armour/health, and weapons such as the ARX, sticky grenades, flashbangs, etc. rather than things like the Auger, AA-12, shield wall, and sentry.
This style of ERT would land either via helicopters as usual, or via a vehicle convoy entering the map from the road that goes outside of the map's playable space.
Has something similar been suggested before? If so, why is your suggestion different?:
Almost certainly not.
Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2):
- CI is inherently unbalanceable, and just letting it go is the only viable option
- As it is, CI has a central issue to its entire existence - CI's main purpose is to mess with the Foundation and cause them as much trouble as possible. On the wiki, this makes sense, has reasons, and has worked in numerous tales. But on the server, as a permanent faction, this means that CI are always causing trouble for one specific site, rather than the more realistic and manageable take within wiki tales, where CI is more of a trouble due to long-term undercover CI plants and raids on various sites every now and then. As a permanent faction, they need to raid more often, otherwise they essentially have nothing to do and no purpose to existing (they aren't exactly capable of a broad range of RP, because their whole goal is just to destroy the Foundation and to look out for themselves - ask yourself "When was the last time I saw anyone below CI CO actually do any roleplay?", and "Have I ever done real roleplay as CI, or just combat?"). With them having to raid constantly lest they fall into inactivity and obscurity, this means they need to raid very often - every hour or so, in fact, as seen at the moment. CI mains may have fun doing combat like this, but for most of the server, this just means they have to constantly fight CI or hide from them, or fight or hide from the breaches and whatever else they cause) - every hour. In theory, this just doesn't seem to make much sense in RP, and in practice, this means that many roles are often completely prevented from doing RP very frequently. You want to test? Sorry, CI are in D-block again. Oh, they left? Ah, they've raided again and now 3 SCPs are out, so you can't actually go down into HCZ. But that's already with it being one hour between raids - if you make it any longer, they basically don't have anything to do and they'll die out anyway. There doesn't seem to be a feasible way to balance this, and at this point I think the best option is to stop trying to and just change it entirely.
- Less frequent raids and DCs -> less regular RP disruption
- This is and has been an issue for as long as I have been on the server, and I can't see this changing unless CI is either massively nerfed/restricted into oblivion, or until it's actually just changed properly.
- Pre-defined and enforced raid/DC objectives -> less raids that just lead to code black-level situations or general widespread RP disruption
- Instead of CI raiding just to breach as many SCPs as possible, or hold garage, or hold 914, or hold 079, or whatever dumb shit they usually do with no real objectives and no plan of surviving, they instead are incentivised to actually have an objective and plan to try and survive, and the objectives might actually make sense.
- Incentivised/enforced escape after objectives -> CI actually value their own lives in RP and generally act more sensibly
- DC spawning as the job -> Less disguise cards -> Disguises actually make sense and aren't magical instant copies
- DC spawning as the job -> DCs don't die before they even get a disguise -> DCs are more likely to actually get to do interesting stuff and have fun
- Pre-defined DC objectives -> DCs don't just kill/kidnap people randomly and disrupt RP for no reason
- CI removal as a constant surface threat -> surface primarily becomes a place for inter-faction RP between Foundation, GOC, civilians and the civilian government, rather than a constant battleground
- Maybe people might actually try to do RP as civ roles finally
- Maybe Foundation and GOC might be able to have relations with each other that aren't restricted by having to also consider CI all the time
- CI and Nu-7 removal -> Spreads players between fewer jobs
- -> More activity on non-combative roles -> More RP over combat
- -> Space for other new, more RP-friendly roles
- -> Less "job bloat" -> Every department/faction is actually active, rather than being split between too many different groups
- Nu-7 ERT -> CI/D-class/whatever can't just hold a chokepoint and camp for 30 minutes due to it being almost impossible to push certain places
- Nu-7 ERT -> Foundation combatives can actually enter from surface level in a limited capacity during a raid -> More opportunities and makes sense, generally
- Nu-7 removal -> No more of the split between DEA and Nu-7 where there's not enough for two very related groups to operate on that just hurts both groups
- Just generally makes more sense RP-wise. Why would Foundation not just bomb a nearby known CI base and flatten them? Why would Nu-7 be stationed here? Why would DCs just be random people wandering in from surface and grabbing magical instant disguises instead of actual long-term plants. Many such questions.
- Removal of CI structure and a randomised or first-come first-serve system of TB/Jugg role selection -> No more CI higher ups hogging TB and jugg most of the time
Possible Negatives of the suggestion:
- Short-medium term upheaval
- This is a major change, even if it's for the better overall
- People losing roles they worked for feels bad
- Can be partly mitigated by offering opportunity to move into equivalent roles in other departments/factions, e.g. CI COM -> GOC/MTF/GSD/DEA CO/Manager, or Nu-7 CO -> MTF/GSD/DEA CO/SpA/Manager
- Is, in my opinion, worth it for the overall long-term benefits
Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted:
This would overall massively reduce regular RP disruption in the long-term, which has been a consistent issue no matter what CT/SL/NL has tried over the years. I don't think there's any way to actually fix this without just outright removing CI as a permanent faction, and I think the replacement I've suggested would be a good alternative to add some spice and to keep some fun aspects of CI (raiding and countering) and the VIP benefits related to the faction (TB and DC would still exist and be limited to VIP, they'd just be deployed in a different format), while losing some key problems (raids spiralling due to them lasting too long and not having goals [or self-preservation], frequency of disruption, raids essentially just being MRDM but allowed, etc.). I don't think CI really fits as a permanent faction, but I think a system like what I've described could keep them as a fun aspect of the server (and a continued draw to new players) while massively improving the state of RP overall. Their current state just doesn't fit an RP server, and doesn't seem like it ever will, and I genuinely do not think this change would really detract from the overall server experience in any meaningful way outside of the short-term upheaval that such a large change would cause regardless of the end result.
