Denied Napoléon SOP rebalance suggestion

[François "Napoléon"]

Alright this will be a long one so be ready to read.
Note: Some edits where made and some new changes have been added.
What does this suggestion change/add/remove:
This suggestion would rebalance the entire loadout of SOP to make more sense. To explain my point and before putting the actual changes i'll explain what I think is wrong with the way SOP is made.
SOP is made of both DEA and NU7. As it stands gear wise, DEA is just better in every single way possible. DEA can have acces to a max amount of:
12 Flash/Smoke(6 are vip locked but 6 are not and that is large)
8 snipers (All on CL4 jobs too)
5 M249
while also having:
Access to drones (being the only one)
Disguise kits

All of this would be fine however here comes the issue. NU7 is meant to defend against raid and help fight on surface, DEA being more specialised in recon, infil and overal surface exploration.
NU7 are on paper the big guns, the army that comes in when shit hits the fan to kill CI. They also deal with code 1 the most. It's exactly because of this that we where always nerfed or left behind to make it balanced, all our guns in general where just weaker version of what CI would get.
One of the best example is the rpk, it is just the MK8 with better damage and recoil. They have all of the low recoil high damage guns and it makes sense, they need to be able to win a raid, otherwise they will never make it down and be able to do deals, if not for it they would not be able to do shit. But nowaydays CI is really strong, thanks to the new type blue they already received a decent buff.
Fighting them is getting harder and even tought many will say "skill issue" you have to realise, CI gear is just better. I have been NU7 for more then a year and every time a ci drops a gun I would pick it up, because it just is better.
Before DEA we had External affairs (and Beta1 but they where really inactive). External was also well balanced for CI. In general I was fine with CI being good, same for GOC. Most of the server is balanced for what they do. But for some reason SOP is not. And just feels inconsistent compared to the rest.

Just to show some of it I made quick testing with the NU7 spawn gun the gry (A perma gun as well) has high recoil and rather medium damage.
3 tap to the head and 5 in the body for 34 shots. If we where to compare the gun to the AS VAL that gun as two times less recoil shoot just as fast and instead kills to the torso with 7 shots. In general most of the perma guns are better then the gry so at that point getting a perma is an upgrade compared to that gun, just that already is a good sign of how NU7 was never touched compared to everyone else.

Now where is the problem. NU7 is still in that nerfed state, but DEA? They get the m249 (a gun we where told SOP would never get) DSR and all that good gear. They are meant to recon but get better guns, better utility and just overall more stuff, and they also still fight CI? As it stand the balancing makes no sense and this suggestion aims to change the DEA and NU7 loadout to make more sense and make both of them balanced and not have one be busted while one is under powered.

Here are some possible changes (Content is free to take what they feel is good and what they don't agree with. I just want people to at least get an idea of the rebalancing idea):
Changes in RED are changes that might be uneeded/Overkill compared to the rest

Gun changes:
-Reduce the gry recoil to be more in line with the sopmod (slightly weaker but still better then now), potentially reduce the mag size to 30
-Increase Sopmod mag size to around 35 or increase damage of the sopmod
-Reduce the MK8 recoil (A small reduction would already be huge)
Loadout changes:
-Remove M249 from segnior agent and replace with MK8, Change NU7 autorifleman MK8 to M249 (would reduce the 5 M249 to 2, make DEA less op while keeping Lmg's wich are better then regular guns)
/Remove the DSR from External agency manager, can be replaced by QBU88 Or a,other long range/medium rifle (MK18?)
\Swap the NU7 COM MK8 with QBU88/ other Long/medium range gun (Would depend on what change happened to the agency manager, removes the absurd amount of lmgs to be instead long range weapons)
-Change NU7 COM Sopmod to M4 9mm (Weaker gun to compensate the new long range option given)
-Special agent Change DSR to MK18 (The amount of foundation 1 tap sniper is too high, MK18 is more like a scar and would feel less dumb, I do think CI would enjoy more getting less 1 taps because DEA can get 8 of them 10 with NU7)
-Change Change the Fang from the segnior agent to the GRY, replace NU7 medic gry with fang (A small buff to DEA to compensate for the nerfs to the heavy loadout, nerf to NU7 medic since unlike CI and GOC we keep our main gun, they don't)

Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2):
-Make DEA and NU7 more balanced together. Both are somewhat inline and have gear to match while still keeping the main focus of SOP.
-More fair for CI. They know what to expect since now both departments are balanced with the same idea in mind instead of having a random group of DEA with too many lmg's.
-Less one tap snipers, foundation should not get that many.
-Small buff to NU7

Possible Negatives of the suggestion:
-DEA might see this as a non justified nerf (altought they still have loads of nades and access to really good gear)
-CI could see this as a big buff to NU7 which might make raids harder.
-Might be unbalanced.

Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted:
I have to say, yes i'm in NU7, but this is not done because of my regiment. It's done from my GM experience and surface experience. Over time I have been able to notice just how strange it is that loads of GOI/DPT are quite well balanced, and then we have foundation SOP that is completly two sided, one is good, the other is bad. Only saving grace until now was our "numbers" and even then it was because CI was inactive. If some of my changes might be unbalanced I hope that at least the core idea is seen. NU7 for reason unknown as so many CQC style guns (MK8, GRY, LR300) but not guns to compete long range against CI and their low recoil weapons. All the long range we have is in DEA and it's for some reason really good, too good in fact. This change is not done to buff one thing and nerf the other, it's to make it make sense. NU7 and DEA should be balanced together because they work together. If we want surface to be fair and raids to be as well we need to make both be good, and before someone says if DEA gets nerfed NU7 won't want to work with them I don't agree, you still can turn into someone and use drones, I can't, that is what makes DEA unique, it should not be the fact that you can get 5 of the best foundation LMG on your second rank.
CI being strong is fine, but right now we need at least a change to make it feel more fair.

I hope content team can at least see what I tried to bring up here, and think carrefully of the SOP balance. CI and GOC are fine, but SOP is not.

 

[François "Napoléon"]

Reduce some slots, and i do agree that 2 jobs shouldnt have the dsr

Reducing slot would be too much. Unless content team wants to this would be even worse of a nerf. Litteraly removing the amount of specific players you can have.

 

[Michael Dzhetnikov]

Reducing slot would be too much. Unless content team wants to this would be even worse of a nerf. Litteraly removing the amount of specific players you can have.

Fair, At least one job should have DSR? And yes the M249 should be replaced.

 

[John Ion Wells]

-support
now i can say yes that dea may be a bit op but the pborblem is we dont have any medics or sheilds
in gernal dea is both an raid attack and an sneaky attacker but with removing some of it will be an mass nerf and at the stage of dea RN it can be fatal for the deptment and becasue of the risk of killing dea fully it is not acceptable​

 

[François "Napoléon"]

-support ​

now i can say yes that dea may be a bit op but the pborblem is we dont have any medics or sheilds​

in gernal dea is both an raid attack and an sneaky attacker but with removing some of it will be an mass nerf and at the stage of dea RN it can be fatal for the deptment and becasue of the risk of killing dea fully it is not acceptable​

Altought this might be true you have more utility. You have large amount of nades. Drones (really usefull in raid might I add) and kits to disguise. You have really good utility. Combine that with good weapons and it makes no sense. The little utility we get is quite low and we get shit weapons too. Balance wise this makes no sense.

 

[Broda]

Unsure how to swing on this one. Special Agents having DSR is fine as they can use it to assassinate individuals who are a threat to the Foundation. The LMG on Senior Agent? That needs to go for sure. Replacing it with something close range could work nicely, perhaps an unused weapon. DEA operate on dealing with GOIs as a whole where as Nu-7 is a Military, so each job in each respective department/regiment should reflect this.

I do have to reflect Johns comments as a change this drastic may kill the department whilst it is undergoing some help with reforming it. There's a few factors at play here @François "Napoléon" and you as Nu-7 Commander need to reflect heavily on server health and engagement with departments. Do bare in mind, your frustration with loadouts etc has seemingly spread to your members which in turn has caused quite the toxicity outburst towards the DEA. If you are to push for a change like this, lets all be mature and sit down with both groups to find a more reasonable outcome. In the grand scale of things, loadouts won't fix your problem either.

Edit: Just remember that DEA is the fusion of Beta-1 and Intelligence, there will be some improved armaments to reflect that merger.

 

[François "Napoléon"]

Unsure how to swing on this one. Special Agents having DSR is fine as they can use it to assassinate individuals who are a threat to the Foundation. The LMG on Senior Agent? That needs to go for sure. Replacing it with something close range could work nicely, perhaps an unused weapon. DEA operate on dealing with GOIs as a whole where as Nu-7 is a Military, so each job in each respective department/regiment should reflect this.

I do have to reflect Johns comments as a change this drastic may kill the department whilst it is undergoing some help with reforming it. There's a few factors at play here @François "Napoléon" and you as Nu-7 Commander need to reflect heavily on server health and engagement with departments. Do bare in mind, your frustration with loadouts etc has seemingly spread to your members which in turn has caused quite the toxicity outburst towards the DEA. If you are to push for a change like this, lets all be mature and sit down with both groups to find a more reasonable outcome. In the grand scale of things, loadouts won't fix your problem either.

Edit: Just remember that DEA is the fusion of Beta-1 and Intelligence, there will be some improved armaments to reflect that merger.

These changed where talk to many and not just nu7. I infact spoke to some dea too as well. Like said in the post this is not just to nerf dea. I just gave the idea of what to change. They can take what they think is right and what they don't. In general this change is more like an example. But I still think that giving one dpt better gear compared to the other that does similar thing is stupid. There should be some balancing done to make one make sense over the other. You are able to get intel drone out have utility and good guns. In general this feels like too much for a dpt. When compared to the mtf that just rush in and get shittier stuff, that makes no sense. I am not doing this just because I am nu7. This is also because of gm experience. If you have ever seen any war any conflict on surface, nu7 gets wiped even when we try our best because if we have a full on one on one we get out ttked. This should not happen as often as it does.

Now for the toxicity thing. I don't agree. Altought yes it caused some people being made the main toxic remarqs just come from the old nu7 mentality wich was quite toxic to other department. Altought I am actively trying to fix it people just always find a way to complain about dea. But weapon balance is not the reason why. It's more due to duties and how people think that SA prefers DEA over nu7. If you have complaints on behavior I don't think that this suggestion should be the "reason" as to why we have issues between our dpt.

 

[Broda]

Have you filled in the content teams form about weapon changes? That has seemingly already had a good effect.

I only brought the toxicity side up as it seems to fuel some responses on here.

Ensure you speak to the DEA Directors about this also, if you haven't done so already.

 

[François "Napoléon"]

Have you filled in the content teams form about weapon changes? That has seemingly already had a good effect.

I only brought the toxicity side up as it seems to fuel some responses on here.

Ensure you speak to the DEA Directors about this also, if you haven't done so already.

I did fill in the form and also talked to some content about the issue. In general tbh this suggestion is somewhat pointless now due to the fact that some of the ideas are somewhat known by some content members I talked to.

 

[KalebStar]

+Support

 

[Rushi]

Moving this to denied, as it's already being discussed with the upcoming loadout changes. We will take this suggestion into consideration.