Rule Suggestion Ranger rp rule rework

[Landon]

What does this suggestion change/add/remove: Please for the love of god rework the rules around rangers and their RP. either change or remove their existing relationship with GOC. ever since they added those rules surface rp has mostly died other than parawatch. Any time i try to do rp or go on an investigation into foundation or try to figure out in rp what they are and what there doing i almost always get stopped by admins saying that we have to run it through with GOC first before doing literally anything. Im not saying to completely remove all restrictions on rangers they still have to gain reasons in rp and only shoot people when shot at/ being threatened

Has something similar been suggested before? If so, why is your suggestion different?: Yes once before by isle kat to glaze pam (This is unrelated to pam and their associates i have no affiliation with them i just want better surface rp )

Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2): Better surface RP. and foundation, CI and GOC actually having to maintain the vail of secrecy unless they want to deal with a very pissed pinewood. More freedom to RP as a ranger or mayor as well as being your own group and not mini GOC goons. GOC can now attempt negotiations with rangers and the mayor instead of them having to listen to them.

Possible Negatives of the suggestion: Less control over rangers and pinewood as a whole for GOC.

Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted: I really think that rangers and pinewood as a whole can make some really fun and good rp for all involved but of course with any suggestion there's always going to be bad people who abuse the jobs but that shouldn't mean that ranger activity should be monitored and controlled by GOC most of the time. the rangers and mayor should feel like their own separate entity from all the other factions and should slowly figure out where they lie and what the other bases are doing in rp. Now im not saying they should be able to start an all out war against all the other factions but i want them to be able to defend their town in whatever way they can and be able to investigate and question inside foundation with reason approved by the mayor without being dictated by the GOC.

 

[Evil]

It would be too fun for civilians to be independent SSL and NL won't allow it
+Support

 

[Landon]

It would be too fun for civilians to be independent SSL and NL won't allow it
+Support

But fr tho the only rp on surface I’ve ever seen after that change was mc&d sampling and schizo parawatch. Ts harms so much rp on surface

(Also I’ll try my best to respond to every comment with arguments as to why this is harmful to surface rp as a whole and needs to be changed but criticism is still very much accepted it did take me a while to write this suggestion but there still could be flaws in it but I still think that the rule needs to be at least reworked a little if not changed completely)

 

[[PAM-OFC] Isle Khat]

One of the reasons they said to me when I did a suggestion like this was
"Our system does not need fixing as of right now", i wish you goodluck on this one.
That was for the UNGOC veil of secrecy change, since that was all done not in rp at all, and nothing was said about it happening, it just spontaneously came about which was some bs, should've happened on active hours because back then i was on 24/7 pretty much, the UNGOC prolly wanted the veil of secrecy really bad.

 

[Advil Smith]

Yo Tylenol smith here this is never going to be changed after my many talks with people because they treat civilians has pretty much npcs in the combat server +support

 

[Ghost05]

+Support
Give Rangers a Type-Blue aswell

 

[JayCee13]

+Support
Give Rangers a Type-Blue aswell

Rangers jugg when?
+Soup

 

[chez_curd]

+support
I'd love handling infobreaches from rangers and the mayor, it gives GOC something to do instead of sitting in the FOB killing eachother

 

[camel brotha]

+Support

The extreme lack of control makes me feel like the money I spent on the VIP was almost wasted. It's more like D-Class than a ranger meant to protect his town from the nearby enemies.

 

[Guts]

what a surprise

remove goc

 

[Sneefo]

+support
i miss the days before the veil of secrecy changes, i only play surface for mcnd but seeing a different mayor on surface or ocomms daily was actually fun and made surface feel alive, pinewood was popping for a good while

these days i barely ever see a mayor or rangers doing fun rp

however i dont have the perspective of the gois having to battle rangers and mayors everyday so ymmw

 

[Max Henry]

+Support, Make Pinewood Active Again!

 

[Jonny "Bear" Hartman]

Ranger has become a minge role as of late.

In my experience of running surface events, playing a surface faction CO, trying to make MCND a true faction, and as staff; I have seen 4 types of rangers:

Militia: Rangers who arm the civilian populace of pinewood and just try to declare war on those who don't bend over backwards for their... RP?

Bored MTF: I constantly see bored groups of MTF get on Ranger and raid CI or kidnap DEA (specifically DEA for some reason)

New players: Typically, if a new player gets on Ranger, they're usually clueless about surface or don't know how the job works. I will try my best to guide these people and help them make RP as Ranger but with a lack of anything happening on surface, I don't see them stick around too long

Rangers that try: I have seen some try their hardest to generate RP and attempt to have the GOC back them up. However, this will usually end up in a warzone between GOC/Pinewood and another faction because something goes awry or someone just doesn't want to take the RP seriously. These players are the one I GENUINELY feel bad for because they want to see the civilian faction go beyond just characters for people to scavenge on, or heavy gun dealers to sell CI crates of shit before they do a D Block siege.

Advil specifically really tried to do this and as GOC I tried to help him, but we just couldn't keep the situation under control. Too many people with something to prove or RP to ruin.

I don't think that the state the UNGOC is in allows them to really exercise dominion over Pinewood, as the last time we tried to do so and generate surface RP, not even 10 minutes later the CI COM blew the UNGOC General's head off in the ranger station and ended up causing a week-long war. Surface isn't conducive to RP when the three factions on surface are constantly making it warzone, and they get ignored or rolled over in the middle of it.

At the same time, like the incident we had only last night, a group of rangers constantly violating rules and attempting to raid CI base back-to-back, kidnapping SOP, and KOSing CI, that isn't the move either. Even though I will admit it got CI and Foundation to work together against the Rangers because no GOC were on but, that isn't how RP should be generated.

This is just me ranting about surface RP but, while I think that GOC should have a vested interest in keeping civilians safe, Civilians and Mayor/Rangers should not be beholden to the whims of the GOC. I would imagine that the town of Pinewood came to this area before any of our factions did and that would make them suspicious of us, so why would they be willing to take our orders? Just because we are the 'Canadian military' or the 'United nations'? I hardly think that is realistic. Humans are naturally curious and untrusting.

Anyway.

I think if Civis and Ranger/Mayor can prevent themselves from deteriorating into being minges, they should be uncoupled from GOC. (I also think that Mayor should be made a whitelist that can job ban rangers, personally).

Best of luck with your suggestion,
+ Support

 

[Advil Smith]

Ranger has become a minge role as of late.

In my experience of running surface events, playing a surface faction CO, trying to make MCND a true faction, and as staff; I have seen 4 types of rangers:

Militia: Rangers who arm the civilian populace of pinewood and just try to declare war on those who don't bend over backwards for their... RP?

Bored MTF: I constantly see bored groups of MTF get on Ranger and raid CI or kidnap DEA (specifically DEA for some reason)

New players: Typically, if a new player gets on Ranger, they're usually clueless about surface or don't know how the job works. I will try my best to guide these people and help them make RP as Ranger but with a lack of anything happening on surface, I don't see them stick around too long

Rangers that try: I have seen some try their hardest to generate RP and attempt to have the GOC back them up. However, this will usually end up in a warzone between GOC/Pinewood and another faction because something goes awry or someone just doesn't want to take the RP seriously. These players are the one I GENUINELY feel bad for because they want to see the civilian faction go beyond just characters for people to scavenge on, or heavy gun dealers to sell CI crates of shit before they do a D Block siege.

Advil specifically really tried to do this and as GOC I tried to help him, but we just couldn't keep the situation under control. Too many people with something to prove or RP to ruin.

I don't think that the state the UNGOC is in allows them to really exercise dominion over Pinewood, as the last time we tried to do so and generate surface RP, not even 10 minutes later the CI COM blew the UNGOC General's head off in the ranger station and ended up causing a week-long war. Surface isn't conducive to RP when the three factions on surface are constantly making it warzone, and they get ignored or rolled over in the middle of it.

At the same time, like the incident we had only last night, a group of rangers constantly violating rules and attempting to raid CI base back-to-back, kidnapping SOP, and KOSing CI, that isn't the move either. Even though I will admit it got CI and Foundation to work together against the Rangers because no GOC were on but, that isn't how RP should be generated.

This is just me ranting about surface RP but, while I think that GOC should have a vested interest in keeping civilians safe, Civilians and Mayor/Rangers should not be beholden to the whims of the GOC. I would imagine that the town of Pinewood came to this area before any of our factions did and that would make them suspicious of us, so why would they be willing to take our orders? Just because we are the 'Canadian military' or the 'United nations'? I hardly think that is realistic. Humans are naturally curious and untrusting.

Anyway.

I think if Civis and Ranger/Mayor can prevent themselves from deteriorating into being minges, they should be uncoupled from GOC. (I also think that Mayor should be made a whitelist that can job ban rangers, personally).

Best of luck with your suggestion,
+ Support

The types of players you listed are quite accurate. I really wish there was more stuff to do with civilians so people don’t resort to doing random stuff like that. I do not play Ranger/Mayor anymore but some things that I think could work is:

- Mayor elections (I would recommend server wide just so it’s not a group of civilians)
- surface scps (I would like to see passive scps or inanimate scps)
- a cool idea could be like jobs kind of how quests are done except it’s like deliver boxes to wherever
-Either the change of mayor/rangers being allowed to infobreach or them knowing about it IC kind of as a cl1 knowledge holder so there could be RP of visits and the rangers could arrest parawatches
- more crime RP such as like murder but there has got to be RP behind them which I don’t know who is good at that
- more interactions with GOI possibly meetings about combat in pinewood or on parawatches
- STOP USING CIVILIAN DISGUISES FOR YOUR COMBAT(this one annoys me because then we get id and weapon checked for no reason)
- just more stuff to do up there so people aren’t bored in general
- more funny stuff ( I’ve been class f’ed many times it gives them some RP to do )

Those are just some tiny suggestions but yeah I wish we had more things to do. I tried working on some these things and if you guys want to play surface try some RP things on your own, I will say a main attraction of pinewood is casinos and lots will come if you do right!

- Tylenol smith, that one guy who played ranger and mayor a while ago

 

[World]

Rule Suggestion - Removing GOC stuff from Ranger & Mayor

This suggestion removes the UNGOC from the descriptions of Mayor and Ranger job, and the documents within Ranger Station. Furthermore this suggestion makes Civi RP more fun and free, without the hegemony of the staff pausing RP every five seconds for an in RP issue and not a staff issue. I...

civilnetworks.net

 

[Landon]

Rule Suggestion - Removing GOC stuff from Ranger & Mayor

This suggestion removes the UNGOC from the descriptions of Mayor and Ranger job, and the documents within Ranger Station. Furthermore this suggestion makes Civi RP more fun and free, without the hegemony of the staff pausing RP every five seconds for an in RP issue and not a staff issue. I...

civilnetworks.net

I mentioned in the suggestion that this was already made once before but it’s not because “it doesn’t align with how you want to roleplay” this rule hinders rp in the fact that you have to listen to The GOC and can’t do anything around that. it went from being able to negotiate as mayor to the GOC about whatever you were doing to listen to these military people or get a failrp warn. Among
Many other reasons which many of the people here want to change

 

[Advil Smith]

Rule Suggestion - Removing GOC stuff from Ranger & Mayor

This suggestion removes the UNGOC from the descriptions of Mayor and Ranger job, and the documents within Ranger Station. Furthermore this suggestion makes Civi RP more fun and free, without the hegemony of the staff pausing RP every five seconds for an in RP issue and not a staff issue. I...

civilnetworks.net

Clearly things have changed I was told rangers on USA server would never get armoury yet now we have. The two options are this suggestion or actually have them know what they have to hide otherwise it wouldn’t make sense to not say anything or investigate about the info.

 

[TwinninXbow]

Pam literally ruined the surface rp on the us sever by kidnapping and selling dea to ci and doing "curropt ranger rp" this would just mean that they are like unmonitered and now don't have to follow anyone's orders and half the time they don't even listen to goc anyway yea a 100% -support

 

[Emilia Foddg]

...I see we're having this discussion again. I've seen the arguments on both sides, stated my support for the revision of this in past suggestions and my stance is unchanged.

I really don't think the correct way to fundamentally crack down on minging on a role is to lock down its roleplay with ruleplay. It adds no extra assurances and reduces no work. Regardless of what rules you enforce on a role, you're still moderating against minging. If anything, having the rules be that Rangers are some level of subsidiary to GOC gives staff more work as it's just more "unwanted behaviour" on the role to curtail. I've always disagreed with this specific thing in principle. It's quite frankly, insane - And I shudder to think what possible roleplay environment could have formed on the US server that caused staff to deem this necessary.

What in the hell are you doing over there?!
+Soft Support

 

[Advil Smith]

replying to the person who mentioned PAM let me ask you this what “surface rp” are you talking about? I certainly don’t see surface RP. I was in PAM at one point and my main goal was building up relations. I attempted to set up meetings and it became clear to me there was no intentions of content team or RP leads of improving surface experience. Now you can go off and say PAM caused them to feel this way but I disagree. Sure PAM had a lot of issues and I’ll be first one to say that but it also Atleast tried to make RP in a place where most didn’t see it as possible.