Content Suggestion Make Nu-7 Enlisteds CL2

[Zen]

What does this suggestion change/add/remove:
Using the new rank clearance system, make Nu-7 Enlisteds (PVT-LCPL) CL2 instead of CL3. SOP/Nu-7 areas such as their offices or compound should be similarly reduced, or access overrides given as appropriate (e.g. make SOP outer doors and Nu-7 barracks CL2, but keep DEA areas CL3).

Has something similar been suggested before? If so, why is your suggestion different?:
No.

Possible Positives of the suggestion (At least 2):

• Restricts clearance levels in a way that makes more sense
  • Nu-7 primarily deals with conventional weaponry and its use on surface. They don't need to know more SCP stuff in depth, like all the CL3 SCPs and whatever, and they don't need access to all of the SCP chambers, offices, etc. behind this clearance level. Whenever they do need to know, or have access to these areas, they'd likely be involved in things led by their superiors or other departments anyway, so they can just be told or granted access by these people. If SRU doesn't need to know or access CL3 stuff, neither do Nu-7 Enlisted, when they should be as far from the SCPs as possible most of the time.
• Makes clearance levels across site less flat
  • Pretty much everyone that is at all experienced is CL3. It seems to be pretty much the "default" clearance level, and it's sometimes seen as the start of when people are actually expected to be able to RP. This shouldn't be the case - clearance levels should be based on what actually makes sense in RP, not what OOC levelling expectations would suggest (it shouldn't be that you essentially get higher clearance levels the more the player is experienced, it should be based on their character/role).
• Encourages Nu-7 to actually be in the areas they are intended to be in, like surface and compound
  • They're often instead just in random areas of the site essentially acting as an expanded GSD. Surface level seems to often be completely abandoned at times. This has three issues: it doesn't make sense in RP for compound/garage to remain unguarded for long periods of time, it shifts other departments' roles and opportunities to Nu-7, and it means that CI raids can just easily get to LCZP uncontested and without warning. This issue comes and goes, but is recurring and is heavily dependent on things like who is online, and the general state of Nu-7 and its leadership at any given time.

Possible Negatives of the suggestion:

• Nu-7 can't support E-11 and the like as easily
  • Enlisteds shouldn't be going off on their own in places like LHCZ and whatever anyway. They should have their superiors with them, or be under supervision of the people actually in charge of those areas.
• People want to have higher clearance levels because it makes them feel special, even if they don't actually need it for their role
  • I get wanting to have more because you've done more or are a more experienced player or whatever, but this should be based more on your current role, not your OOC time spent or whatever. As it is, it would make more sense for roles like SRU or Tech Expert to be CL3 over Nu-7 Enlisteds, because they're at least supposed to be within the site all the time, and more often be in places like D-block vents or SCP chambers respectively.

Based on the Positives & Negatives, why should this suggestion be accepted:
It just makes RP sense, and it is a good step towards both unflattening the current "CL3 is the default" expectation, and setting clearance levels based on what actually makes sense and is needed more generally.

 

[qShad]

-Support

 

[Average member podidski]

my guy, this is not zenith project.

 

[Dan Roth]

How are they gonna open up the garage door which is CL3 and the lobby doors which are also CL3 i think they need to remain at CL3 you dont join Nu7 just to become a CL2 again.

 

[Merrick Travolta]

How are they gonna open up the garage door which is CL3 and the lobby doors which are also CL3 i think they need to remain at CL3 you dont join Nu7 just to become a CL2 again.

overrides exist, Also response unit exists, the MTF tryout requires you play as a cl1 anyway (cadet) so like... ?

I do think they should retain the knowledge afforded to them as clearance 3's just due to the nature of their work if this does go through (Handy little image of the uk clearance knowledge guide attached I'm aware usa doesn't follow this but It's like the wild west over there with knowledge)



I will -support just due to how all the MTF's structures are supposed to somewhat mirror (With A1 and O1 having fewer slots). But I wouldn't care either way

 

[Vxnt]

remove this from your signature.


Possibly the most dumb and needless change I've ever heard of </3

I think I'd rather see that one guy who suggested an E11 job that gets ESP on SCPs be accepted than this </3.

-Support, obviously.

 

[Zen]

overrides exist, Also response unit exists, the MTF tryout requires you play as a cl1 anyway (cadet) so like... ?

I do think they should retain the knowledge afforded to them as clearance 3's just due to the nature of their work if this does go through (Handy little image of the uk clearance knowledge guide attached I'm aware usa doesn't follow this but It's like the wild west over there with knowledge)

View attachment 22818View attachment 22819

I will -support just due to how all the MTF's structures are supposed to somewhat mirror (With A1 and O1 having fewer slots). But I wouldn't care either way

Out of all of this, though, what do they actually need to know for their role? The CL2 stuff, plus maybe the surface SCP chems. That's it. They don't need any of the rest.

 

[Emilia Foddg]

I can see the spirit - And this would make it significantly more difficult for CI to get useful cards, which I see as a net positive change. I also see the obvious benefit of reducing minging from Nu7 Enlisted, although this is kind of a moot point since we kinda have it down pat?

However this is mostly just going to cause RP confusion in terms of clearance knowledge (Nu7 often assists in the recontainment of CL3+ SCPs and this is going to make people confused about whether or not they should be amnesticated post-breach, etc. Although I'm not really confident in that since they've been CL3 for so long and it's such a hassle to go through that people will just acclimate to the idea that they have this knowledge IC, which they should, IMO) and clearance authority (By the Chain of Command, Nu7 Enlisteds are above a significant number of CL3 personnel in terms of authority - So from that perspective, the idea being that a CL2 Nu7 could issue orders to a CL3 Researcher feels like it might be confusing, as clearance tends to also be synonymous with authority.)

I wouldn't mind trialling this change to see how it affects the server. The decreased supply of CL3 keycards to CI may be worth trying to make this a thing. So if this is at all viable, I think it would actually be worth investigating. I feel like a lot of us attach too much of our worth to our clearance and that feels apparent from reading the responses here so far. I would definitely raise this with Nu7 leads on US & UK.
+...Cautious Support?

I will -support just due to how all the MTF's structures are supposed to somewhat mirror (With A1 and O1 having fewer slots). But I wouldn't care either way

I can see this, but honestly, speaking from experience as E-11 CPT, I think that E-11 PVTs & SPCs should also be CL2.

Possibly the most dumb and needless change I've ever heard of </3

Permit him the use of the culinary facilities.

 

[Arlos]

 

[Michael Dzhetnikov]

then make all the enlisteds one level lower with overrides.

 

[Zen]

then make all the enlisteds one level lower with overrides.

I wouldn't truly mind it, but to me, it doesn't make sense except for Nu-7. E-11 needs to access all of HCZ and have SCP knowledge, AO needs to be able to support SC, Nu-7... what? Need to know to shoot at CI and how to use vehicles? That's not Foundation clearance, that's all stuff any armed forces personnel or just knowledgeable civilians would know. The only things they directly need to know outside of that is surface SCP stuff, and to be quite honest, I have no idea what clearance level those SCPs are even considered to be.

 

[Average member podidski]

I can see the spirit - And this would make it significantly more difficult for CI to get useful cards, which I see as a net positive change. I also see the obvious benefit of reducing minging from Nu7 Enlisted, although this is kind of a moot point since we kinda have it down pat?

However this is mostly just going to cause RP confusion in terms of clearance knowledge (Nu7 often assists in the recontainment of CL3+ SCPs and this is going to make people confused about whether or not they should be amnesticated post-breach, etc. Although I'm not really confident in that since they've been CL3 for so long and it's such a hassle to go through that people will just acclimate to the idea that they have this knowledge IC, which they should, IMO) and clearance authority (By the Chain of Command, Nu7 Enlisteds are above a significant number of CL3 personnel in terms of authority - So from that perspective, the idea being that a CL2 Nu7 could issue orders to a CL3 Researcher feels like it might be confusing, as clearance tends to also be synonymous with authority.)

I wouldn't mind trialling this change to see how it affects the server. The decreased supply of CL3 keycards to CI may be worth trying to make this a thing. So if this is at all viable, I think it would actually be worth investigating. I feel like a lot of us attach too much of our worth to our clearance and that feels apparent from reading the responses here so far. I would definitely raise this with Nu7 leads on US & UK.
+...Cautious Support?

I can see this, but honestly, speaking from experience as E-11 CPT, I think that E-11 PVTs & SPCs should also be CL2.

Permit him the use of the culinary facilities.

Are you his friend? Every time he makes suggetion, you +support him no matter what. Im not pointing finger at you but this is very suspicious.

 

[Emilia Foddg]

Are you his friend? Every time he makes suggetion, you +support him no matter what. Im not pointing finger at you but this is very suspicious.

I mean, yes? But I really only know Zen from this community. Zen and I are just generally on the same wavelength when it comes to ideas and I generally have a positive outlook when it comes to suggestions, unless the suggestion is either unsalvageable or unconsciably damaging. I find that Zen almost always produces workable or interesting ideas.

I wouldn't truly mind it, but to me, it doesn't make sense except for Nu-7. E-11 needs to access all of HCZ and have SCP knowledge, AO needs to be able to support SC, Nu-7... what? Need to know to shoot at CI and how to use vehicles? That's not Foundation clearance, that's all stuff any armed forces personnel or just knowledgeable civilians would know. The only things they directly need to know outside of that is surface SCP stuff, and to be quite honest, I have no idea what clearance level those SCPs are even considered to be.

IIRC, they're considered CL3? From my limited time in the regiment so far, we do deal with some CL3 stuff - Especially as C1s often take us into CL3 areas and/or the raids themselves have CL3 goals, and again, we sometimes assist in C5s, too. But honestly, clearance knowledge alone shouldn't necessarily limit clearance itself - In addition to contributing to a lot of the assumptions I mentioned before, this also serves a practical purpose.

 

[James Kenraali]

>get levels To officer (CL3) To join a tryout
>lose being a CL3 after the tryout.
-Support

 

[Skinner]

>get levels To officer (CL3) To join a tryout
>lose being a CL3 after the tryout.
-Support

-support

 

[Evil]

CI we must -support this so they cannot be stronger and less lazy

 

[Puma 'Providence']

- Support
Doesn’t makes sense

 

[Sceptre]

+ Support
I think this is an appropriate change and better reflects Nu-7's actual statistics, being a battalion-strength task force with hundreds of men. Reducing the amount of CL3 roles on the server should be something that occurs, because when everyone is special - no one is special.

This should better incentivise Nu-7 doing their jobs on surface, and teach newcomers to MTF their core duties, rather than being able to freely access 95% of the site's doors.

 

[Chest Rockwell]

-support
This got to be one of the stupidest suggestions ever

 

[Kaiser Walker]

-Support

You make an appeal to it being more logical but most MTF's in lore have CL3, it is more uncommon then it is common to see ones with less. MTF are highly specialized top rate personnel. You could make an argument for other departments starting off with CL2's for IC reasons, but this is not one of them.

This does not account at all for CI being in the facility. Having a large portion of Nu7 that aren't able to open CL3 doors is a terrible idea. Can't access D Block vents when CI are held up in showers, can't enter a large amount of HCZ i.e. lower and almost if not all of the SCP CC's in it when CI are breaking them out. It cripples sweeps in area like HCZ due to that. The point is to spread out and search but if every enlisted has to stay glued to whatever high ranks are on that isn't fun nor logical. You dismiss this by saying they are usually with higher clearance personnel in those scenarios but we already have huge issues with the clotting of combatives during breaches and raids behind doors they can't access, we don't need to make that problem even worse. Not to mention if the higher rank they're following dies they're just screwed.

Enlisted Nu7 is NOT equivalent to an SRU, you'd have to have already become an Officer to even attempt the tryout and they are held to a higher standard. You're basically proposing SRU but Nu7 and it's for all the enlisted. It's like making Officers CL2 because technically most of their duties don't need them to be CL3, and technically a higher rank can just be with them for it instead/they can have bypass.